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Bayonetta 3 - Release Date Trailer


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People are now using Hellena’s politics against her and whatever they can reach for to try and discredit her, but if she was still the VA for Bayonetta and that stuff was only now found out, only a loud minority would be cancelling their preorder of the game; even less than the people cancelling their plans for the game as is.

 

And some said it was unprofessional how Hellena addressed the whole mess. Not seeing how you can blame her though. Everyone has a breaking point, so of course she's gonna have a breakdown.

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Being real here, Hellena has every right to address her issue and the way she did in the first 2 vids. There's no debate for me there she was unprofessional, (personally here) to each their own if it means she tarnished herself. What taints the whole message is the last vid bashing Jennifer Hale, I take issue with and dissolve any cause for her. (in that sense, but at same still feel bad how she was mistreated in the first 2 vids) Yes, she had bonds with the character Bayonetta and is passionate with her training and work toward it but the same cause you are letting us know you are putting someone in your field who could be in the same situation down. How is that productive to your overall message? She could of, if possible not mention that she owns Bayonetta voice and put down another fellow VA in the same vein. But emotions are what we make of them so if she wanted it out there, it's out there now.

 

It's funny I've seen so many takes on this whole matter but not a lot are bringing the bashment of another VA in the same industry your bringing to light is a issue that needs closer attention with VO work in general.

 

Like Jennifer said in her response, I hope a peaceful resolution can be met to all who are affected by this. I can't it will fully fix in either perspective but its worth trying for all that love the Bayonetta series, developers and gamers.

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Hellena seems to deny this, sticking to her version of the story. She’s already been risking her future and what’s left of her career with this, so I'm more inclined to believe her, as she has more to lose than gain at this point. Between a company trying everything to cover their ass from a scandal or a person overwhelmingly stressed and frustrated and risking everything to get back at said company, I'm more willing to believe the latter.

 

The issue beyond that and things is that all Platinum needs to do is muddy to the waters to the point where the internet does a masses shrug, goes “both sides were in the wrong”, and dismiss the thing as a lot of noise, which some have already started doing.

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If it turns out Helena really was lying, then not only has she put herself on a blacklist for breaking NDA over a lie, but also cast a shadow over the efforts of her peers in the voice acting industry who've spent this entire year fighting tooth-and-nail for fair wages and union representation.

 

We live in an era where a fucking YouTube content creator gets paid more for shilling Raid Shadow Legends than dedicated voice actors get paid for starring in the most financially-successful anime movie since Your Name. And that's only if they're lucky enough to even be asked to reprise their role to begin with instead of being replaced by Chris Pratt.

 

Like, I get where Hellena is coming from. She brought this character to life; Bayonetta is like her daughter. And I say that as someone who goes to a lot of conventions and talks to a lot of voice actors. But her career isn't the only one that could be on the line due to this whole fiasco.

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Unless it's something serious, i.e. criminal, when I see anonymity being used, I generally am going to feel the truth is on the other side. It would have been better if Platinum left the situation alone personally, because there has been a point made regarding the current talent involved working on Bayonetta 3, at all levels, and that they shouldn't be thrown under over a pay dispute. Now, the report is making the offer look worse since they're trying to cover up Hellena's side. This likely won't ultimately impact whether or not I buy Bayonetta 3, but it won't feel as good to make the purchase as it usually would. 

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I agree this new information sure muddy things (businesses can be cruel to get their means, no denying to not side with when things go south with hired help or employees) but I don't look at either side wrong but both are innocent until one is proven guilty. This new information provide tho anonymous makes sense because the ppl a part of the deal, another NDA. Like I said since the vids been out there's more to this than what started this. Whenever PG is gonna say something it is not gonna make things any better it will most likely be a lawsuit so we may never get to the bottom no matter where anyone stands with this.

 

At this point both were caught in supposed lie, first with PG reporting Hellena not available reprise her role of Bayonetta earlier this month when they said Jennifer Hale is taking the role of Bayonetta in Bayonetta 3. This past weekend Hellena rebutting that is not true and was lowballed to come back as Bayonetta. To today, sources privy to the deal says there's more to the story and it was session pay of $4k and she asked for 6 figures and residual pay. I concur for a 3rd outing for a major franchise and major character to renegotiate terms.

 

So tho Hellena is sticking to her story as she has a lot to lose, right now this back and forth, the bottom when it comes to who might be neutral state in these affair one way or the other. There has to be more info we are still missing with even with the anonymous sources so far as late and why right now it is funny to say both sides are innocent till a 3rd party that have no stake says which story is which here.

 

No matter how you look at this difficult to say one way or the other but hopefully can respect any decision when it comes to boycott or where one stand with Hellena or PG when it comes to the ppl who made the game not the ppl who invloved with deal with Hellena.

Edited by DLurkster
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Just for some other perspective while on the topic of general voice acting... And how poorly Nintendo regards it. Nintendo's one of the most conservative companies out there, so them being possibly to blame as much as Platinum for the current case checks out to me; keyword being possibly.

 

That aside, it is becoming funnier to me how this whole fiasco is the most attention the Bayonetta series has ever gotten. Part of why Bayonetta has remained niche even under Nintendo, is the lack of marketing. It goes back to Nintendo's mentioned conservatism though, and Bayonetta 3 got the bare minimum in marketing, so of course some fiasco to the level with the voice actors was gonna give the game much more attention than it otherwise would've.

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There's definitely been a pattern with Nintendo conservative measures with developing games with VA, is not a priority. No denying that.

 

There's latest and greatest 1st party wise is BotW, not that one finds out what the pay was there but to think the effort that went to make that game, the pay for VA in that game were about peanuts. And no royalties hurt as well. Tho, that game wasn't fully VA, it was the most voiced 1st party game for Nintendo compared to their last efforts in dabbling VA in their 1st party games.

 

So yeah, I can see where Nintendo would should fault with all the Bayonetta 3 fiasco as well.

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There is likely a greater discussion to be had regarding adequate pay for voice actors in general, but assuming the most recent information is true then I can't side with Hellena on this.  It was already pretty dirty that she insisted that Jen Hale had no right to the character as if she owned the character.  No doubt, Hellena's voice is iconic to Bayonetta and is so recognized, but that was approaching some prima donna "me and only me" levels of entitlement.  But it seems as more and more of the story came out some things didn't seem to sit right and the latest bit of info from Bloomberg does not paint the greatest picture for Hellena.  At best she simply omitted some information but at worst she manipulated the audience that empathized with her struggle.  That one of her final responses on the matter is that she would rather put this behind her and move on just tells me that she was never really in this to create a conversation, but cause a stir and while I can definitely side with putting a spotlight on the pitfalls of contract gigs like VA work there's no goodwill behind leveraging that message to drag the game and those involved because what she was being given was less than the supposed six figure payout with residuals that she was wanting.

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Yes, the truth is still somewhere out there. Why does that sound familiar?

 

And tho the true story is staking center stage now of this fiasco, we lest not forgot no matter how entangled Hellena message was, this was to put a spotlight on VA being paid so little with no due and hope discussions around residual pay. From what I learned with SAGA union, pay sessions and the strike they had in 2016 about getting better pay. The only thing that amount from that strike was slight better rates per session and bonus pay, I believe how successful a game is. This bonus pay is not the same as residual pay or else this discussion of VA still being underappreciated wouldn't be happening today.

 

Most things in the entertainment business of acting have residual pay so why isn't the same applied for VA?

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1 minute ago, DLurkster said:

Yes, the truth is still somewhere out there. Why does that sound familiar?

 

And tho the true story is staking center stage now of this fiasco, we lest not forgot no matter how entangled Hellena message was, this was to put a spotlight on VA being paid so little with no due and hope discussions around residual pay. From what I learned with SAGA union, pay sessions and the strike they had in 2016 about getting better pay. The only thing that amount from that strike was slight better rates per session and bonus pay, I believe how successful a game is. This bonus pay is not the same as residual pay or else this discussion of VA still being underappreciated wouldn't be happening today.

 

Most things in the entertainment business of acting have residual pay so why isn't the same applied for VA?

 

That's probably a question for SAG.  Having read information elsewhere they don't even notate video games in their categories eligible for residual compensation.  But then how would that work?  TV Shows it seems easier when they get re-runs or go into syndication; for example paying Ashton Kutcher everytime That 70's Show shifts to run on a new network; but the initial run only nets them their initial pay.

 

With a videogame it's just that one product that's it.  The only additional compensation you even could do is if they release that game for other platforms down the road or maybe do a remake of it if they intend on using the same cast.  But that's a far more limited range of potential for compensation compared to a TV show or movie that can air independently day to day or in some cases multiple times within the same day.  So then how do you calculate residual compensation then?  My only thought is potential offering a percentage of each sale, but then what should that percentage be?  How binding would that agreement be?  Imagine being lucky enough to land a gig doing voice work for a game that sells 20+ million while someone else lands a gig doing voice work for a game that may only sell a few thousand.  Even a flat 5% rate would look wildly different in each of those scenarios and only one of those games has a likely chance at being reintroduced later on to generate residual compensation.

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7 minutes ago, Kezay said:

 

That's probably a question for SAG.  Having read information elsewhere they don't even notate video games in their categories eligible for residual compensation.  But then how would that work?  TV Shows it seems easier when they get re-runs or go into syndication; for example paying Ashton Kutcher everytime That 70's Show shifts to run on a new network; but the initial run only nets them their initial pay.

 

With a videogame it's just that one product that's it.  The only additional compensation you even could do is if they release that game for other platforms down the road or maybe do a remake of it if they intend on using the same cast.  But that's a far more limited range of potential for compensation compared to a TV show or movie that can air independently day to day or in some cases multiple times within the same day.  So then how do you calculate residual compensation then?  My only thought is potential offering a percentage of each sale, but then what should that percentage be?  How binding would that agreement be?  Imagine being lucky enough to land a gig doing voice work for a game that sells 20+ million while someone else lands a gig doing voice work for a game that may only sell a few thousand.  Even a flat 5% rate would look wildly different in each of those scenarios and only one of those games has a likely chance at being reintroduced later on to generate residual compensation.

That in essence is the issue of video games and what the rule of re-release or remake is. Aptly said.

 

There's a lot more, I know but just saying it or figuring out sounds like a headache no one wants to take on. For all we know maybe that is why there is residual in place cause it will take that long, that is the optimistic take. Of course the other is it is not worth it bothering to find a way with video games.

Edited by DLurkster
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Another factor is that "professional" voice acting in video games is a relatively new concept compared to cartoons or anime. The earliest fully-voiced games like Star Fox 64 just went with either local radio personalities from around NOA's headquarters, or drama school students who answered an ad in a newspaper. We didn't start getting voice actors in games who actually voice act for a living until Final Fantasy X, which, at the time, would have been considered a one-off gig for them. But now that video games are considered a major subset of the entertainment industry in their own right, it's time we started reminding the higher-ups that voice actors are still actors.

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That's the ironic thing of the video game industry as a whole grossing the most in the entertainment industry today.Yet, despite that VA in video games aspect is still kinda new, I think that view and the value ontop of how to move forward is why the pay for VA in video games will be difficult one to fair compensation and manage.

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Now, that I think about at least when it came to the announcement of Bayonetta 2 being exclusive to Nintendo was a bit controversial. (if one can call it that?)

 

So 2 of the 3 title where framed with publicity that at the time were not pleasant.

 

Tho, niche still now thinks about how insane it is exclusive when the game released on Wii U and here to day with Bayonetta 3 on Switch. How times have changed but sort of remain the same, huh?

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On 10/20/2022 at 7:18 PM, DLurkster said:

Now, that I think about at least when it came to the announcement of Bayonetta 2 being exclusive to Nintendo was a bit controversial. (if one can call it that?)

 

So 2 of the 3 title where framed with publicity that at the time were not pleasant.

 

Tho, niche still now thinks about how insane it is exclusive when the game released on Wii U and here to day with Bayonetta 3 on Switch. How times have changed but sort of remain the same, huh?

 

Bayonetta 2 being Wii U exclusive indeed came with its own controversy.  The worst part is when it was revealed the only reason there was a Bayo 2 was because Nintendo funded its development and there were people who would have preferred there have been no Bayo 2 if it meant it would be Nintendo exclusive.

 

The controversy this time around is much different but the sentiment of some hoping that Bayonetta 3 bombs is not unlike what people were wanting Bayonetta 2 to do back then.

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