DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Well, you run a scenario where up to four rounds, let's keep going thru the brackets and see how many playing against ourselves there will be. If there's a lot to tend to, I don't think there's much we can do to remedy it unless we know a match before that to do a best of till we get different match ups. So for example by the fourth round (continuation of the 3rd round) what ever characters are left each best of will use a different character from our team. Let's make it best of 3 so 2 to wins. Who ever have most in the best will move on to next round with that character they won the most will use that character and any left till the end of the tourney. How does that sound and does it make sense? Getting out the ideas now cause it seems tomorrow is a no go to hash things out with you. Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 8 minutes ago, DLurkster said: Well, you run a scenario where up to four rounds, let's keep going thru the brackets and see how many playing against ourselves there will be. If there's a lot to tend to, I don't think there's much we can do to remedy it unless we know a match before that to do a best of till we get different match ups. So for example by the fourth round (continuation of the 3rd round) what ever characters are left each best of will use a different character from our team. Let's make it best of 3 so 2 to wins. Who ever have most in the best will move on to next round with that character they won the most will use that character and any left till the end of the tourney. How does that sound and does it make sense? Getting out the ideas now cause it seems tomorrow is a no go to hash things out with you. So,.... numerically speaking.... 4 Smashers @ 8 "seeded" fighters apiece = 32 So #1 for each person would be the #1 of the four quadrants A #1 fights a #8, 2 a 7, 3 a 6, 4 a 5..... I mean, to table it out one could argue there would be a person/fighter pair as the overall #1 and thus a overall as #32. Each person would have two reps in each quadrant. I kind of run into roadblocks for seed pairings Also, I think I'd be in favor of timed matches with OT as that would represent games more accurately than stock matches. Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 3 minutes ago, purple_beard said: So,.... numerically speaking.... 4 Smashers @ 8 "seeded" fighters apiece = 32 So #1 for each person would be the #1 of the four quadrants A #1 fights a #8, 2 a 7, 3 a 6, 4 a 5..... I mean, to table it out one could argue there would be a person/fighter pair as the overall #1 and thus a overall as #32. Each person would have two reps in each quadrant. I kind of run into roadblocks for seed pairings Also, I think I'd be in favor of timed matches with OT as that would represent games more accurately than stock matches. Is the 'a' be the pair of your team of fighters. I get the team of 8 for each person but how would that exactly run into roadblock of seeding if the pair is even? Also, I am down for timed matches for the whole duration not only for easy tracking but for time. The reason there time or as much time as it is that it takes certain amount of minutes to widel down stocks at average players level. That is why by default I have 7 minutes on for 3 stock free-for-alls. As you some matches it ends 2-3 minutes earlier depending who SD or the stage. In some rare cases with the last 2 fighters and they are evenly matched it takes the whole 7 minutes. So let's make all matches 4 minutes long the whole during of tourney. Quote Link to post

TKrazyO 513 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 If you're planning for this to be on Saturday, I won't be on. I'll be doing this months Cooldown Saturday stream. Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 Ah, I remember you saying this last week and I forgot and assumed in this discussion there will be 4 folks this weekend. That throws things off now for sure. Well that gives us more time to plan this so about this; we do this tourney thing next when the 3 amiibo release next week, the week after is Smashdown so the week after that we can do amiibo theme of Byleth, Terry and Banjo, how does that sound @purple_beard? Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 38 minutes ago, DLurkster said: Is the 'a' be the pair of your team of fighters. I get the team of 8 for each person but how would that exactly run into roadblock of seeding if the pair is even? Also, I am down for timed matches for the whole duration not only for easy tracking but for time. The reason there time or as much time as it is that it takes certain amount of minutes to widel down stocks at average players level. That is why by default I have 7 minutes on for 3 stock free-for-alls. As you some matches it ends 2-3 minutes earlier depending who SD or the stage. In some rare cases with the last 2 fighters and they are evenly matched it takes the whole 7 minutes. So let's make all matches 4 minutes long the whole during of tourney. 1 versus a 8, 2 a7.... 2 vs. 7 ********** And well with TKO out.... maybe we got to a round robin or whatever....cause to make it somewhat work... need 4.... Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 1 minute ago, purple_beard said: 1 versus a 8, 2 a7.... 2 vs. 7 ********** And well with TKO out.... maybe we got to a round robin or whatever....cause to make it somewhat work... need 4.... I follow now, putting those letter confused me for a bit. Round robin would work because it is based on point system per round to go to the next round and would go by a lot more quicker especially with making the tourney timed. So how should the points go for 3 folks and how many rounds then? Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 16 hours ago, DLurkster said: I follow now, putting those letter confused me for a bit. Round robin would work because it is based on point system per round to go to the next round and would go by a lot more quicker especially with making the tourney timed. So how should the points go for 3 folks and how many rounds then? I think things are leaning to picking a t64 fighters and seeding them. Then pick matchups. With three confirmed players double elimination might be the way to go. Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 42 minutes ago, purple_beard said: I think things are leaning to picking a t64 fighters and seeding them. Then pick matchups. With three confirmed players double elimination might be the way to go. Explain in detail how double elimination will work. I thought out how a round robin of 3 participants will work. up to 12 rounds for the whole tourney 6 fighters for each of the 3 participants. Up to round 4 you need 4 points to get to round 5, so let's make it so you get 2 point per round so at most there will be at least be 4 rounds so there will be 2 participants from round 5 to round 12. During those matches you need to accumulate 12 points to win the tournament overall. By Round 5 you probably lost 2 fighters out of the 6 in total so like the last 4 rounds based on the points was 4 round to get to 12 points need at least 7 rounds at most if the matches are close when it comes to points. Points each match during this 7 is still 2 points each. Hopefully that makes sense, let me know if there's anything I need to breakdown more. Remember each of these matched are time for 4 minutes each for shorter time and easy tallying KO wins as well. Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 @DLurkster Short story short, you have to lose twice to be eliminated So: a vs. b, a wins/ b loses a plays c -*if a wins, plays winner of loser bracket between b and c -*if c wins, a moves to loser bracket c plays b, if b loses b is done, lost twice -depending on how finals shook out, if c took just one L, a would just need one win against c, if c beat a, c has to beat a again... Basically, with two losses you are eliminated. Depending on final results bracket winner would have to beat winner twice. ******************* @DLurkster @Eliwood8 Any way you guys want to either: a) draft out 32/64 fighters or b) seed out your top 8 fighters or.... I think we need the fighters we want to use settled first before we get into bracketing up something. Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 1 hour ago, purple_beard said: @DLurkster Short story short, you have to lose twice to be eliminated So: a vs. b, a wins/ b loses a plays c -*if a wins, plays winner of loser bracket between b and c -*if c wins, a moves to loser bracket c plays b, if b loses b is done, lost twice -depending on how finals shook out, if c took just one L, a would just need one win against c, if c beat a, c has to beat a again... Basically, with two losses you are eliminated. Depending on final results bracket winner would have to beat winner twice. ******************* @DLurkster @Eliwood8 Any way you guys want to either: a) draft out 32/64 fighters or b) seed out your top 8 fighters or.... I think we need the fighters we want to use settled first before we get into bracketing up something. Did you even read or understood my post to you? I get how double elimination works with losing twice (hence the name, duh), never organized on but played a Sm4sh tourney hosted by Nintendo and battlefly. I am sorry I should of been more specific; how would the draft and/or seeds work with 3 players to proceed winning and losing brackets. And yes, we need fighters so to get the ball rolling I will say mine 8: Hero, Pyra/Mythra, Byleth, Snake, Yoshi, Kirby, Young Link, and Link. Again, ask me any questions about my setup and if we are to do mine, I'll be taking out fighters Yoshi and Kirby to do the 6 fighters in mine own version. Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 16 minutes ago, DLurkster said: Did you even read or understood my post to you? I get how double elimination works with losing twice (hence the name, duh), never organized on but played a Sm4sh tourney hosted by Nintendo and battlefly. I am sorry I should of been more specific; how would the draft and/or seeds work with 3 players to proceed winning and losing brackets. And yes, we need fighters so to get the ball rolling I will say mine 8: Hero, Pyra/Mythra, Byleth, Snake, Yoshi, Kirby, Young Link, and Link. Again, ask me any questions about my setup and if we are to do mine, I'll be taking out fighters Yoshi and Kirby to do the 6 fighters in mine own version. Well if crafting a roster set I was going to say we each pick down to the amount--basically each person picks a fighter in turn for the bracket set. Then we could do seeds, and pick match ups. If we go the other way then each of us submits a ranking 1-? of our fighters. Then we could work out pairings using seed #s. Never tried figuring the math out with three players. Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 19 Share Posted March 19 4 minutes ago, purple_beard said: Well if crafting a roster set I was going to say we each pick down to the amount--basically each person picks a fighter in turn for the bracket set. Then we could do seeds, and pick match ups. If we go the other way then each of us submits a ranking 1-? of our fighters. Then we could work out pairings using seed #s. Never tried figuring the math out with three players. Okay, I'm down to do whatever type of tourney but question is are we doing tourney next week with either double or single elimination with four players? or we going to do the round robin I set up of 3 ppl. I have done the math, I believe it checks out if you can confirm for me. We seem to be either all over the place or on two different pages of players and when because that is what matters is in choosing which one. If you want to do a tourney style tomorrow with 3 ppl, then my robin round tourney would do the trick or if want to do your single or double elimination it seems better to do that next week when we have 4 player. I think it is honestly better to plan a tourney with even number for that style for the math to work. I don't see another way, at least to me that I can possibly think of So which is it now? Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 19 Author Share Posted March 19 I mean.....I'm fine with whatever... One we get past roster setup the rest will flow.... We could a post 1st hour amiibo theme. Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Okay, I'll take that as open to anything from the usual Saturday to robin round tomorrow. Hmmm, well let's try out this robin round tourney setup, ya? Just to get out if this type tourney can work. I am like a little more then 80% it can work with the math I did with the players, fighters, points, and rounds at most for fighters lost and point gained. For next week, PB you can do the either hour amiibo and usual Saturday or single or double elimination tourney, I want to try that and give you opportunity to give it a go? If we do end up doing the former next week, it would mean the other tourney won't be till after next month showdown, that will be 2 weeks from now will do that other tourney. How does that sound for tomorrow and and the following weeks? ---------- Reminder of how the round will work out: Quote How a round robin of 3 participants will work. It will be up to 13 rounds for the whole tourney 6 fighters for each of the 3 participants. Up to round 5 you need 4 points to get to round 6, so let's make it so you get 2 point per round so at most there will be at least be 5 rounds so all 3 participants will be down 2 participants. During the rounds of 6 to 13 at most those matches you need to accumulate 12 points to win the tournament overall. By round 6 you probably lost 2 fighters out of the 6 in total so like the last 5 rounds based on the points was 5 rounds to get to 4 points, we need at least 7 rounds at most if the matches are close when it comes to points. Points during these rounds each will still be 2 points each with. Hopefully that makes sense, let me know if there's anything I need to breakdown more. Remember each of these matches are time for 4 minutes each for shorter time and easy tallying KO wins as well. A basic breakdown is like this for the first 5 rounds. DL vs Eli=Eli wins 2 points (I spectate next match and I'm down to 5 fighters now cause I lost) Eli vs PB=PB wins 2 points (Eli spectates and he is down 5 fighters now) DL vs PB=DL wins 2 points (PB spectates and is down to 5 fighters) DL vs Eli=Eli wins 2 points (he has 4 points and can proceed to next phase) PB vs DL=DL wins 2 points (DL and Eli will face off with each other in the next phase till either of use get 12 points to win the tourney) Last 4 rounds simplified DL vs Eli=Eli wins (6 points total, I'm down to 4 fighters) DL vs Eli=Eli wins (8 points total, I'm down to 3 fighters) DL vs Eli=Eli wins (10 points total, I'm down to 2 fighters) DL vs Eli=Eli wins (12 points total, he wins the tourney) If the full 7 rounds slightly nuanced DL vs Eli=Eli wins (6 points total, I'm down to 4 fighters) DL vs Eli=DL wins (6 points total, Eli is down to 4 fighters) DL vs Eli=Eli wins (8 points total, I'm down to 3 fighters) DL vs Eli=DL wins (8 points total, Eli is down 3 fighters) DL vs Eli= Eli wins (10 points total, I'm down to 2 fighters) DL vs Eli=DL wins (10 points total, Eli is down to 2 fighters) DL vs Eli=Eli wins (12 points total, he wins the tourney) Hopefully this was better for all to understand a better breakdown of who's who, fighters, points, rounds and phases then the wordplay I had before explaining the above. Remember all matches are times for 4 minutes each and obviously 1v1 match, no items. This wasn't mentioned before but each participants will take turns from choosing omega stages and battlefield to be fair with some of the characters we choose. Some characters have advantages either format so sticking to one professional format is not ideal. Speaking of characters as I said to @purple_beard; these are my 6 characters I'll be using: Hero, Pyra/Mythra, Byleth, Snake, Young Link, and Link. Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 20 Author Share Posted March 20 @DLurkster If you got your setup worked out we can use it tonight. However, are you playing out a scenario where Person/Smasher as winner is the same set you use in the next round, same with loser pair? How many pairs of Person/Smasher are you doing? OR, whoever we want to use in any given round? ******************** @Eliwood8 , @DLurkster, @TKrazyO Can you guys post your personal ranked fighters for yourself. I'd need at worst a 1-8 ranking for each of us. Also, try to think about your T16 and you can go 1-8, 9-16 1 is the character you are the best with in your own opinion. 16 would be the character you would be the worst with if you ranked them out. *The functions of the 1-16 ranking are to come up with overall bracket set up, seeding set up, and other metrics. DO NOT WORRY ABOUT PICKING/SEEDING a character the same as someone else... should the need arise we can go alt colors if it ends up being Core parameter will be timed match with sudden death to determine winner. A pair will advance to the next round, in other words whomever you win with you play that down till you lose. Once a pair loses that pair is done just like a normal bracket. With this information the actual bracket can get set up for next week. I can use excel to set up some stuff. ***IF*** you guys prefer doing a T64 Smash Character bracket and we pick matchups then we will need all four of us to draft from the Smash Roster till we hit 64 picked characters to set up. I'll figure out someway to seed them. ***************** ***************** MY T16 PB #1 ROB #2 Bowser #3 Terry #4 Pac Man #5 Incenroar #6 Corrin #7 Roy #8 Dark Pit --------- 9) Min Min 10) Mr. Game & Watch 11) Sonic 12) Banjo 13) Marh 14) Palutena 15) Dr. Mario 16) Young Link Quote Link to post

Eliwood8 1368 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Picking 16 favorite fighters is honestly kind of hard, and ranking them just makes things trickier. I'll go with this I guess: 1 - Dark Samus 2 - Wii Fit Trainer 3 - Marth 4 - Hero 5 - Little Mac 6 - Byleth 7 - Robin 8 - Inkling ********** 9 - Pyra/Mythra 10 - Greninja 11 - Zelda 12 - Chrom 13 - Peach 14 - Sephiroth 15 - Pit 16 - Captain Falcon Quote Link to post

DLurkster 1019 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 2 hours ago, purple_beard said: @DLurkster If you got your setup worked out we can use it tonight. However, are you playing out a scenario where Person/Smasher as winner is the same set you use in the next round, same with loser pair? How many pairs of Person/Smasher are you doing? OR, whoever we want to use in any given round? No pairs like I see you doing, just 6 fighters as said. If you win a round you stay as that fighter till you lose. I see why it seem like you were confused, it is easier to probably explain this as Squad mode here. Except your not losing a stock to change character. I was wonder even with my explanation, what you still weren't getting but you mind was still rapped up in pairings. Not saying to trust me PB but to open your mind, when someone breaks things down in two ways to get what is going on. You were still trying to get my tourney setup but still had nugget of pair from your. Let go and interpret what is explained to you. Again, 6 fighters, if you win you keep fighting as that fighter till you lose, simple. Same as Eli, it will be hard to list 8 more characters in some ranking order. Here goes: you have these 8 I said already but here it is slightly changed up: Link, Byleth, Hero, Young Link, Snake, Yoshi, Kirby, and Roy. The other 8 are: Roy, Chrom, Dark Samus, King Dedede, Bayonetta, Olimar, and Fox. Obviously it is best to choose our 16 if as you said to do a t64. So at least you have scenario for 32 with 8 fighter or a 16 with a 64. Just keep in mind the time for a t64. Tho 4 minutes a match plus sudden death, that can get a little long in the tooth and we may have to consider playing maybe a hour earlier. Just a thought. I also see you went straight for elimination style for next week instead of the amiibo theme for the hour, @purple_beard. Once you get the parameter dealt with do you know if single or double elimination, sounds like it will be single from what you describe. @Eliwood8: I am assuming your first 6 of 8 fighters will be the ones you use tonight in the round robin, right? Also, I take it you understand the concept of the round robin? If not just bring the your 6 tonight (move on to the next fighter if you lose) and make sure you alternate between omega and battlefield for stage selection, that's all that you and PB have to do tonight. I'll take care of the rest with KO's, points tally, rounds and phases. Easy right? Quote Link to post

Eliwood8 1368 Posted March 20 Share Posted March 20 Yeah I'll use those top six tonight. Although now that I'm looking at my list I want to shuffle the characters around—this is the problem with ranking things like this for me! purple_beard 1 Quote Link to post

purple_beard 1151 Posted March 20 Author Share Posted March 20 (edited) @Eliwood8 I hear you... ****** If we want to, we could do the draft tonight.... But again, we need to decide your own fighters ranked for seed pairings OR draft a roster then pick matchups. Fwiw, with game and gallery creation I might no be online till 9. Edited March 20 by purple_beard Quote Link to post

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